You want to challenge what I said. Then read all my sources on theoi. You asked for it. I am going to give you every source. I read, read what I said slowly. Nothing I put in is false. Zeus returns Asclepius and the Cyclopes from Hades. What I put in about why Zeus returned Asclepius and the Cyclopes. Is what I read. My statement about Hades holding the dead prisoner in the underworld is true. Very few people go back into the world above. Read about Dionysus returning his mother from Hades. Read about Orpheus returning Eurydike. Why failed Hades didnt want to give her up. Also read about Hercules returning Alkestis from Hades. Also read about Hercules freeing Theseus. Read the story of Asclepius and why he died. As far as you deleting what I put in about Hades and Poseidon also defeating the titans with Zeus. That is a fact. You have no right to delete anything that is a fact. Like I said Wikipedia is a free domain. You dont make the rules. Your a vandal. Read what I said slowly. Have fun reading all my sources. If you want to challenge what I put in.
Orphic Hymn 18 to Pluton (trans. Taylor) (Greek hymns C3rd B.C. to 2nd A.D.) : "To Plouton [Haides]. Plouton, magnanimous, whose realms profound are fixed beneath the firm and solid ground, in the Tartarean plains remote from sight, and wrapt for ever in the depths of night. Zeus Khthonios (of the Underworld), thy sacred ear incline, and pleased accept these sacred rites divine. Earth’s keys to thee, illustrious king, belong, its secret gates unlocking, deep and strong. ‘Tis thine abundant annual fruits to bear, for needy mortals are thy constant care. To thee, great king, all sovereign earth assigned, the seat of gods and basis of mankind. Thy throne is fixed in Haides’ dismal plains, distant, unknown to the rest, where darkness reigns; where, destitute of breath, pale spectres dwell, in endless, dire, inexorable hell; and in dread Akheron, whose depths obscure, earth’s stable roots eternally secure. O mighty Daimon, whose decision dread, the future fate determines of the dead, with Demeter’s girl [Persephone] captive, through grassy plains, drawn in a four-yoked car with loosened reins, rapt over the deep, impelled by love, you flew till Eleusinia’s city rose to view: there, in a wondrous cave obscure and deep, the sacred maid secure from search you keep, the cave of Atthis, whose wide gates display an entrance to the kingdoms void of day. Of works unseen and seen thy power alone to be the great dispending source is known. All-ruling, holy God, with glory bright, thee sacred poets and their hymns delight, propitious to thy mystics’ works incline, rejoicing come, for holy rites are thine."
PALACE OF HAIDES "There, in front [at the ends of the earth], stand the echoing halls of the god of the lower-world, strong Hades, and of awful Persephone. A fearful hound guards the house in front ... keeps watch and devours whomsoever he catches going out of the gates of strong Hades and awful Persephone." - Hesiod, Theogony 767 "The shadowy place of the dead and passed the black gates which hold back the souls of the dead, for all their protestations." - Greek Elegaic Theognis, Frag 1.703 "The Stygian city and the cruel court of swarthy Dis [Haides]. Countless broad entrances that city has and portals everywhere open ... There the Umbrae (Shades) wander without flesh or blood or bones; some gather in the central square; some throng the courts of Tyrannus Imus (Hell’s King) [Haides]." - Ovid, Metamorphoses 4.437 "What of him who holds sway over the dark realm? Where sits he, governing his flitting tribes? There is a place in dark recess of Tartarus [i.e. in Haides], which with a heavy pall dense mists enshroud. Hence flow from a single source two streams, unlike: one, a placid river (by this do the gods sear), with silent current bears on the sacred Styx; the other with mighty roar rushes fiercely on, rolling down rocks in its flood, Acheron, that cannot be recrossed. The royal hall of Dis [Haides] stands opposite, girt by a double moat, and the huge house is hid by an o’ershadowing grove. Here in a spacious cavern the tyrant’s doors overhang; this is the road for spirits, this is the kingdom’s gate. A plain lies round about this where sits the god, where with haughty mien his awful majesty assorts the new-arriving souls. Lowering is his brow, yet such as wears the aspect of his brothers and his high race; his countenance is that of Jove, but Jove the thunderer; chief part of that realm’s grimness is its own lord, whose aspect whate’er is dreaded dreads." - Seneca, Hercules Furens 707 "Beneath our pole [the earth] cut off from the things of the upper world, deep down lies the palace of the Tartarean Father [Haides]; never would it share the fate of the toppling sky, even if the mass were sent rolling ... wide-mouthed Chaos lies, so huge that it would swallow all matter, wearied with its own burden, and the falling universe. Here are the twin doors of the Shades below; one [the gate of Haides], by stern law ever open, receives nations and kinds ... by the left gate, how many monstrous creatures stand upon the threshold." - Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 1.830 "The lord of Erebus [Haides], enthroned in the midst of the fortress of his dolorous realm." - Statius, Thebaid 8.21 "Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone]." - Statius, Thebaid 4.520
KEYS OF HAIDES "Aiakos, even after death, is honoured in the company of Plouton [Haides], and has charge of the keys of Hades’ realm." - Apollodorus, The Library 3.159 "[Depicted on table made by Kolotes at Olympia] On the other are Plouton [Hades], Dionysos, Persephone and Nymphai ... As to the key (Plouton holds a key) they say that what is called Haides has been locked up by Plouton, and that nobody will return back again there from." - Pausanias, Guide to Greece 5.20.2-3 "Earth’s keys to thee, illustrious king [Haides], belong, its secret gates unlocking, deep and strong." - Orphic Hymn 18 to Pluton
HAIDES ATTENDANTS: ROYAL COURT Haides was enthroned in Erebos surrounded by a court consisting of the three Judges of the Dead, the Erinyes (Chthonian Vengeance Demons), the Moirai (Fates), the Keres (Death-Demons) and Thanatos (Death), as well as the personified underworld Rivers. "The lord of Erebus [Haides], enthroned in the midst of the fortress of his dolorous realm, was demanding of his subjects the misdoings of their lives, pitying nought human but wroth against all the Manes (Shades). Around him stand the Furiae [Erinyes] and various Mortes (Deaths) [Thanatoi or Keres] in order due, and savage Poena (Vengeance) thrusts forth her coils of jangling chains; the Fatae (Fates) [Moirai] bring the Animas (Souls) and with one gesture [literally “thumb” as in the amphitheatre] damn them; too heavy grows the work. Hard by, Minos with his dread brother [Rhadamanthys] in kindly mood counsels a milder justice, and restrains the bloodthirsty king; Cocytus and Phelgethon, swollen with tears and fire, aid in the judgement, and Styx accuses the gods of perjury." - Statius, Thebaid 8.21 "Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone]. Black Mors [Thanatos god of death] sits upon an eminence, and numbers the silent peoples for their lord; yet the greater part of the troop remains. The Gortynian judge [Minos] shakes them [the ghosts of the dead] in his inexorable urn, demanding the truth with threats, and constrains them to speak out their whole lives’ story and at last confess their extorted gains." - Statius, Thebaid 4.520
HADES & THE HERO ORPHEUS When Orpheus came to the underworld seeking the return of his dead love Eurydike, Haides and Persephone were moved by his pleas and agreed to let her return. Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 1. 14 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "When his [Orpheus'] wife Eurydike died from a snake-bite, Orpheus descended into Haides’ realm with the desire to bring her back up to earth, and persuade Plouton [Hades] to release her. Plouton promised to do this if on the return trip Orpheus would not turn round before reaching his own home. But he disobeyed, and turned to look at his wife, who thereupon went back down again." Pseudo-Hyginus, Astronomica 2. 7 (trans. Grant) (Roman mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "Orpheus . . . was passionately devoted to music. It is thought that by his skill he could charm even wild beasts to listen. When, grieving for his wife Eurydice, he descended to the Lower World, he praised the children of the gods in his song." Ovid, Metamorphoses 10. 8 ff (trans. Melville) (Roman epic C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "The new-wed bride [Eurydike, wife of Orpheus] . . . fell dying when a serpent struck her heel. And when at last the bard Rhodopeius [Orpheus] had mourned his fill in the wide world above, he dared descend through Taenaria’s dark gate to Styx to make trial of the Umbrae (Shades); and through the thronging wraiths and grave-spent ghosts he came to pale Persephone and him, Dominus Umbrarum (Lord of the Shades) [Haides], who rules the unlovely realm, and as he struck his lyre’s sad chords he said : `Ye deities who rule the world below, whither we mortal creatures all return, if simple truth, direct and genuine, may by your leave be told, I have come down not with intent to see the glooms of Tartara, nor to enchain the triple-snaked necks of Medusaeum [Kerberos], but for my dear wife’s sake, in whom a trodden viper poured his venom and stole her budding years. My heart has sought strength to endure; the attempt I’ll not deny; but love has won, a god whose fame is fair in the world above; but here I doubt, though here too, I surmise; and if that ancient tale of ravishment is true, you too were joined in love. Now by these regions filled with fear, by this huge Chaos, these vast silent realms, reweave, I implore, the fate unwound too fast of my Eurydice. To you are owed ourselves and all creation; a brief while we linger; then we hasten, late or soon to one abode; here on road leads us all; here in the end is home; over humankind your kingdom keeps the longest sovereignty. She too, when ripening years reach their due term, shall own your rule. The favour that I ask is but to enjoy her love; and, if fate will not reprieve her, my resolve is clear not to return: may two deaths give you cheer.’ So to the music of his strings he [Orpheus] sang, and all the bloodless spirits wept to hear; and Tantalus forgot the fleeing water, Ixion’s wheel was tranced; the Belides [Danaides] laid down their urns; the vultures left their feast, and Sisyphus sat rapt upon his stone. Then first by that sad ringing overwhelmed, the Eumenides’ [Erinyes’] cheeks, it’s said, were wet with tears; and the queen [Persephone] and he whose sceptre rules the underworld could not deny the prayer, and called Eurydice. She was among the recent ghosts and, limping from her wound, came slowly forth; and Rhodopeius [Orpheus] took his bride and with her this compact that, till he reach the world above and leave Valles Avernae [Valleys of Hell], he look not back or else the gift would fail. The track climbed upwards, steep and indistinct, through the hushed silence and the murky gloom; and now they neared the edge of the bright world, and, fearing lest she faint, longing to look, he turned his eyes--and straight she slipped away. He stretched his arms to hold her--to be held--and clasped, poor soul, naught but the yielding air. And she, dying again, made no complaint (for what complaint had she save she was loved?) and breathed a faint farewell, and turned again back to the land of spirits whence she came. The double death of his Eurydice stole Orpheus‘ wits away . . . He longed, he begged, in vain to be allowed to cross the stream of Styx a second time. The ferryman [Kharon] repulsed him. Even so for seven days he sat upon the bank, unkempt and fasting, anguish, grief and tears his nourishment, and cursed Erebus’ cruelty." Seneca, Hercules Furens 569 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "Orpheus had power to bend the ruthless lords of the shades [Haides and Persephone] by song and suppliant prayer, when he sought back his Eurydice. The art which had drawn the trees and birds and rocks, which had stayed the course of rivers, at whose sound the beasts had stopped to listen, soothes the underworld with unaccustomed strains, and rings out clearer in those unhearing realms. Eurydice the Thracian brides bewail; even the gods, whom no tears can move, bewail her; and they [the Erinyes] who with awful brows investigate men’s crimes and sift out ancient wrongs, as they sit in judgment bewail Eurydice. At length death’s lord [Haides] exclaims : `We own defeat; go forth to the upper world, yet by this appointed doom--fare thou as comrade behind thy husband, and thou, look not back upon thy wife until bright day shall have revealed the gods of heaven, and the opening of Spartan Taenarus shall be at hand.' True love hates delay and brooks it not; while he hastes to look upon his prize, ‘tis lost. The realm which could be overcome by song, that realm shall strength have power to overcome." Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Must I [Haides] so oft endure the profanation of Chaos by living strangers? . . . It shames me too, alas! how Tartarus opened a way to the Odyrsian plaint [Orpheus]; with my own eyes I saw the Eumenides [Erinyes] shed base tears at those persuasive strains, and the Sisters [the Moirai or Fates] repeat their allotted task; me too--, but the violence of my cruel law was stronger."
II) HERAKLES & ALKESTIS Herakles was sometimes described as battling Haides for the life of Queen Alkestis, who had agreed to die in place of her husband Admetos. Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 1. 106 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "[Apollon] obtained from the Moirai (Fates) a privilege for [King] Admetos, whereby, when it was time for him to die, he would be released from death if someone should volunteer to die in his place. When his day to die came . . . [his wife] Alkestis died for him. Kore [Persephone], however sent her back, or, according to some, Herakles battled Haides and brought her back up to Admetos."
HADES WRATH : PIRITHOUS & THESEUS The hero Peirithoos sought to abduct Persephone, the bride of Haides. As punishment the god trapped him on a stone chair and eternal torment. Theseus, who accompanied him on the expedition, was freed at the request of Herakles. Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca E1. 23 - 24 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "Theseus and Peirithoos agreed with each other to marry daughters of Zeus, so Theseus with the other’s help kidnapped twelve-year-old Helene from Sparta, and went down to Haides’ realm to court Persephone for Peirithoos . . . Theseus, arriving in Haides’ realm with Peirithoos, was thoroughly deceived, for Haides on the pretense of hospitality had them sit first upon the throne of Lethe (Forgetfulness). Their bodies grew onto it, and were held down by the serpent’s coils. Now Peirithous remained fast there for all time, but Herakles led Theseus back up." Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 2. 124 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "As he [Herakles] approached the gates of Haides’ realm [in his quest to fetch Kerberos], he came across Theseus along with Peirithoos, who had courted Persephone with matrimonial intentions and for this reason was held fast as was Theseus. When they saw Herakles they stretched forth their hands as if to rise up with the help of his strength. He did in fact pull Theseus up by the hand, but when he wanted to raise Peirithoos, the earth shook and he let go." Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 4. 63. 4 (trans. Oldfather) (Greek historian C1st B.C.) : "Peirithoos [after helping Theseus abduct Helene] now decided to seek the hand of Persephone in marriage, and when he asked Theseus to make the journey with him Theseus at first endeavoured to dissuade him and to turn him away from such a deed as being impious; but since Peirithoos firmly insisted upon it Theseus was bound by the oaths to join with him in the deed. And when they had at last made their way below to the regions of Haides, it came to pass that because of the impiety of their act they were both put in chains, and although Theseus was later let go by reason of the favour with which Herakles regarded him, Peirithoos because of the impiety remained in Haides, enduring everlasting punishment; but some writers of myths say that both of them never returned." Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 4. 26. 1 : "Herakles then, according to the myths which have come down to us, descended into the realm of Haides, and being welcomed like a brother by Persephone brought Theseus and Peirithoos back to the upper world after freeing them from their bonds. This he accomplished by the favour of Persephone, and receiving the dog Kerberos in chains he carried him away to the amazement of all and exhibited him to men." Plutarch, Life of Theseus 31.2 & 35. 1 (trans. Perrin) (Greek historian C1st to C2nd A.D.) : "[Theseus] to return the service of Peirithoos, [who helped him abduct Helene] journeyed with him to Epiros, in quest of the daughter of Aidoneus the king of the Molossians. This man called his wife Phersephone, his daughter Kora, and his dog Kerberos, with which beast he ordered that all suitors of his daughter should fight, promising her to him that should overcome it. However, when he learned that Peirithoos and his friend were come not to woo, but to steal away his daughter, he seized them both. Peirithoos he put out of the way at once by means of the dog, but Theseus he kept in close confinement . . . Now while Herakles was the guest of Aidoneus the Molossian, the king incidentally spoke of the adventure of Theseus and Peirithoos, telling what they had come there to do, and what they had suffered when they were found out. Herakles was greatly distressed by the inglorious death of the one, and by the impending death of the other. As for Peirithoos, he thought it useless to complain, but he begged for the release of Theseus, and demanded that this favour be granted him. Aidoneus yielded to his prayers, Theseus was set free, and returned to Athens, where his friends were not yet altogether overwhelmed." Aelian, Historical Miscellany 4. 5 (trans. Wilson) (Greek rhetorician C2nd to 3rd A.D.) : "Benefits were remembered, and thanks for them given, by Theseus to Herakles. Aïdoneus king of the Molossians put Theseus in chains when he came with Pirithous to kidnap the king’s wife [i.e. Persephone]. Theseus did not want to marry the woman himself but did this as a favour to Pirithous. Herakles came to the country of the Molossians and rescued Theseus, in return for which the latter set up an altar to him." Pseudo-Hyginus, Fabulae 79 (trans. Grant) (Roman mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "When Jove [Zeus] saw that they [Theseus & Peirithous] had such audacity [kidnapping Helene] as to expose themselves to danger, he bade them in a dream both go and ask Pluto on Pirithous’ part for Proserpina [Persephone] in marriage. When they had descended to the Land of the Dead through the peninsula Taenarus, and had informed Pluto [Haides] why they had come, they were stretched out and tortured for a long time by the Furies. When Hercules came to lead out the three-headed dog, they begged his promise of protection. He obtained the favor from Pluto, and brought them out unharmed." Ovid, Heroides 2. 67 ff (trans. Showerman) (Roman poetry C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "With record of his [Theseus'] deeds. When men shall have read of . . . the knocking at the gloomy palace of the darksome god." Seneca, Phaedra 93 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "Through the deep shades of the pool which none recrosses is he [Theseus] faring, this brave recruit of a madcap suitor [Peirithoos], that from the very throne of the infernal king [Haides] he may rob and bear away his wife [Persephone]. He hurries on, a partner in mad folly; him nor fear nor shame held back. And there in the depths of Acherontis [i.e. the underworld] he seeks adultery and an unlawful bed." Seneca, Phaedra 147 ff : "Suppose that Theseus is indeed held fast [in the underworld], hidden away in Lethean depths, and must suffer Stygia [i.e. the underworld] eternally." Seneca, Phaedra 222 ff : "Trust not in Dis [Haides]. Though he bar his realm, and though the Stygian dog [Kerberos] keep guard o’er the grim doors, Theseus alone finds out forbidden ways." Seneca, Phaedra 625 ff : "The overlord of the fast-holding realm and of the silent Styx has made no way to the upper world once quitted; and will he let the robber [Theseus] of his couch go back? Unless, perchance, even Pluton sits smiling upon love!" Seneca, Phaedra 951 : "[Theseus was] in depths of Tartarus, in presence of dread Dis [Haides], and imminent menace of hell’s lord." Seneca, Phaedra 1149 ff : "Theseus looks on sky and upper world and has escaped from the pools of Stygia, chaste one, thou owest naught to thine uncle, the all-devouring; unchanged the tale remains for the infernal king [i.e. he keeps his bride]." Seneca, Phaedra 1217 ff : "[Theseus returned from the underworld laments his unhappy lot :] `Alcides, give back his boon to Dis [Haides]; give me up again to the ghosts whom I escaped. Impiously, I make vain prayers for the death I left behind.; " Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Must I [Haides] so oft endure the profanation of Chaos by living strangers? The rash ardour of Pirithous provoked me, and Theseus, sworn comrade of his daring friend [when the pair attempted to abduct Persephone]."
HADES WRATH : ASCLEPIUS Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 4. 71. 3 (trans. Oldfather) (Greek historian C1st B.C.) : "It was believed that he [Asklepios] had brought back to life many who had died. Consequently, the myth goes on to say, Haides brought accusation against Asklepios, charging him before Zeus of acting to the detriment of his own province, for, he said, the number of the dead was steadily diminishing, now that men were being healed by Asklepios. So Zeus, in indignation, slew Asklepios with his thunderbolt." Aesop, Fables 133 (from Chambry & Babrius, Fabulae Aesopeae 75) (trans. Gibbs) (Greek fable C6th B.C.) : "[This fable by Aesop contains an allusion to the story of Asklepios :] There was once a doctor who knew nothing about medicine. One of his patients was feeling quite weak, but everyone insisted, 'Don't give up, you will get well; your illness is the sort that lasts for a while, but then you will feel better.' The doctor, however, marched in and declared : `I'm not going to play games with you or tell you lies: you need to take care of all your affairs, because you are going to die; you are not going to last more than another day.' Having said this, the doctor did not even bother to come back again. After a while the patient recovered from his illness and was venturing out of doors, although he was not yet fully steady on his feet. When the doctor ran into the patient, he greeted him, and asked how all the people down in Haides were doing. The patient said, `They are taking it easy, drinking the water of Lethe. But Persephone and the mighty god Plouton [Haides] were just now threatening terrible things against all the doctors, since they keep the sick people from dying. Every single doctor was denounced, and they were ready to put you at the top of the list. This scared me, so I immediately stepped forward and grasped their royal sceptres as I solemnly swore that this was simply a ridiculous accusation, since you are not really a doctor at all."
Homer, Iliad and Odyssey (Greek epic C8th B.C.) : References to Haides in the Iliad and Odyssey, which mostly describe passage to the underworld, can be found on the Realm of Haides I page. Hesiod, Theogony 453 ff (trans. Evelyn-White) (Greek epic C8th or 7th B.C.) : "Haides, pitiless in heart, who dwells under the earth." Theognis, Fragment 1. 244 ff (trans. Gerber, Vol. Greek Elegiac) (Greek elegy C6th B.C.) : "When you go to Aides’ house of wailing, down in the dark earth’s depths." Anacreon, Frag 405 (from Scholiast on Hesiod) (trans. Campbell, Vol. Greek Lyric II) (C6th B.C.) : "Theos Khthonios [i.e. Haides] may mean god of the lower world or sullen god." Aeschylus, Agamemnon 1372 ff (trans. Weir Smyth) (Greek tragedy C5th B.C.) : "Klytaimestra [describes how she murdered Agamemnon] : Twice I struck him, and with two groans his limbs relaxed. Once he had fallen, I dealt him yet a third stroke to grace my prayer to the infernal (khthonios) Zeus, the savior of the dead (nekrôn sôtêr). Fallen thus, he gasped away his life." Aeschylus, Eumenides 273 ff : "For Haides is mighty in holding mortals to account under the earth, and he observes all things and within his mind inscribes them." Aeschylus, Libation Bearers 355 ff : "A ruler of august majesty [King Agamemnon], distinguished even beneath the earth, and minister of the mightiest, the deities who rule in the nether world [Haides and Persephone]. For in your life you were a king of those who have the power to assign the portion of death [i.e. a king has the power of death over his subjects], and who wield the staff all mortals obey." Aeschylus, Prometheus Bound 153 ff : "Haides, the entertainer of the dead (nekrodegmôn)." Aeschylus, Suppliant Women 227 ff : "And how can man be pure who would seize from an unwilling father an unwilling bride? For such an act, not even in Haides, after death, shall he escape arraignment for outrage. There also among the dead, so men tell, another Zeus [Haides] holds a last judgment upon misdeeds. Take heed and reply in this manner, that victory may attend your cause." Aeschylus, Doubtul Fragment 243 (from Hesychius, Lexicon s.v. empedês) : "May Haides, whose portion is the earth, seize and fetter thee!" Aesop, Fables 133 (Chambry 133 & Babrius, Fabulae Aesopeae 75) (trans. Gibbs) (Greek fable C6th B.C.) : "[A fable told in jest :] Persephone and the mighty god Plouton [Haides] were just now threatening terrible things against all the doctors, since they keep the sick people from dying." Plato, Cratylus 400d & 402d - 404b (trans. Fowler) (Greek philosopher C4th B.C.) : "[Plato constructs philosophical etymologies for the names of the gods :] Sokrates : Let us inquire what thought men had in giving them [the gods] their names . . . The first men who gave names [to the gods] were no ordinary persons, but high thinkers and great talkers . . . Let us, then, speak of his [Zeus] brothers, Poseidon and Plouton, including also the other name of the latter . . . Plouton, he was so named as the giver of wealth (ploutos), because wealth comes up from below out of the earth. And Haides--I fancy most people think that this is a name of the Invisible (aeidês), so they are afraid and call him Plouton. I think people have many false notions about the power of this god, and are unduly afraid of him. They are afraid because when we are once dead we remain in his realm for ever, and they are also terrified because the soul goes to him without the covering of the body. But I think all these facts, and the office and the name of the god, point in the same direction . . . Please answer this question : Which is the stronger bond upon any living being to keep him in any one place, desire, or compulsion? Hermogenes : Desire, Socrates, is much stronger. Sokrates : Then do you not believe there would be many fugitives from Haides, if he did not bind with the strongest bond those who go to him there? . . . Apparently, then, if he binds them with the strongest bond, he binds them by some kind of desire, not by compulsion . . . There are many desires, are there not? . . . Then he binds with the desire which is the strongest of all, if he is to restrain them with the strongest bond ... And is there any desire stronger than the thought of being made a better man by association with some one? . . . Then, Hermogenes, we must believe that this is the reason why no one has been willing to come away from that other world, not even the Seirenes, but they and all others have been overcome by his enchantments, so beautiful, as it appears, are the words which Haides has the power to speak; and from this point of view this god is a perfect sophist and a great benefactor of those in his realm, he who also bestows such great blessings upon us who are on earth; such abundance surrounds him there below, and for this reason he is called Plouton. Then, too, he refuses to consort with men while they have bodies, but only accepts their society when the soul is pure of all the evils and desires of the body. Do you not think this shows him to be a philosopher and to understand perfectly that under these conditions he could restrain them by binding them with the desire of virtue, but that so long as they are infected with the unrest and madness of the body, not even his father Kronos could hold them to himself, though he bound them with his famous chains? . . . And the name 'Haides' is not in the least derived from the invisible (aeides), but far more probably from knowing (eidenai) all noble things, and for that reason he was called Haides by the lawgiver." Callimachus, Epigrams 2 (trans. Mair) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.) : "Haides, snatcher of all things, shall lay his hand [upon you]." Callimachus, Fragment Frag 478 (from Etymologicum Florentine s.v. Klymenos) (trans. Trypanis) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.) : "[Persephone] the spouse of Klymenos [Haides], host of many (polyzeinos)." Pausanias, Description of Greece 5. 20. 2 (trans. Jones) (Greek travelogue C2nd A.D.) : "[Amongst the scenes depicted on a table by Kolotes dedicated in the temple of Hera at Olympia :] Plouton [Haides] holds a key, they say that what is called Haides has been locked up by Plouton, and that nobody will return back again there from."
Ovid, Metamorphoses 2. 260 ff (trans. Melville) (Roman epic C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "Earth everywhere splits deep [when Phaethon scorches the earth] and light strikes down into Tartara (the Underworld) and fills with fear Rex Infernus (Hell’s monarch) [Haides] and his consort [Persephone]." Ovid, Metamorphoses 5. 354 ff : "The land [of Sicily] quakes [as Typhoeus the Giant buried beneath it tries to escape] and even the king who rules the land of silence (Rex Silentum) [Haides] shudders lest the ground in gaping seams should open and the day stream down and terrify the trembling Umpire (Shades). The tyrant (Tyrannus) had left his dark domains to and fro, drawn in his chariot and sable steeds, inspected the foundations of the isle." Seneca, Hercules Furens 603 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "I [Herakles] have seen places unapproached by any . . . those gloomy spaces which the baser pole hath yielded to infernal Jove [Haides]; and if the regions of the third estate pleased me, I might have reigned." Seneca, Hercules Furens 658 ff : "All the world’s holy powers, and thou [Haides] who rulest the all-holding realm, and thou [Persephone] whom, stolen from Enna, thy mother [Demeter] sought in vain, may it be right, I pray, boldly to speak of powers hidden away and buried beneath the earth." Seneca, Hercules Furens 707 ff : "What of him who holds sway over the dark realm? Where sits he, governing his flitting tribes? . . . A plain lies round about this where sits the god [Haides], where with haughty mien his awful majesty assorts the new-arriving souls. Lowering is his brow, yet such as wears the aspect of his brothers and his high race; his countenance is that of Jove, but Jove the thunderer; chief part of that realm’s grimness is its own lord, whose aspect whate’er is dreaded dreads." Seneca, Phaedra 625 ff : "The overlord [Haides] of the fast-holding realm and of the silent Styx has made no way to the upper world once quitted." Seneca, Troades 402 ff : "Taenarus and the cruel tyrant’s [Haides] kingdom and Cerberus, guarding the portal of no easy passage." Statius, Thebaid 4. 520 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone]. Black Mors [Thanatos, death] sits upon an eminence, and numbers the silent peoples for their lord; yet the greater part of the troop remains. The Gortynian judge [Minos] shakes them [the ghosts of the dead] in his inexorable urn, demanding the truth with threats, and constrains them to speak out their whole lives’ story and at last confess their extorted gains." Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The lord of Erebus [Haides], enthroned in the midst of the fortress of his dolorous realm, was demanding of his subjects the misdoings of their lives, pitying nought human but wroth against all the Manes (Shades). Around him stand the Furiae [Erinyes, furies] and various Mortes [Thanatoi, deaths] in order due, and savage Poena (Vengeance) thrusts forth her coils of jangling chains; the Fatae [Moirai, fates] bring the Animas (Souls) and with one gesture [literally “thumb” as in the amphitheatre] damn them; too heavy grows the work. Hard by, Minos with his dread brother [Rhadamanthys] in kindly mood counsels a milder justice, and restrains the bloodthirsty king; Cocytus and Phelgethon, swollen with tears and fire, aid in the judgement, and Styx accuses the gods of perjury. But he [Haides], when the frame of the world above was loosened [i.e. when the earth opened up and swallowed the hero Amphiaraus] and filled him with unwonted fears, quaked at the appearing stars, and thus did he speak, offended by the gladsome light: ‘What ruin of the upper world hath thrust the hateful light of day into Avernus? Who hath burst our gloom and told the silent folk of life? Whence comes this threat? Which of my brothers makes war on me? Well, I will meet him: confusion whelm all natural bounds? For whom would that please more? The third hazard hurled me defeated from the mighty heaven, and I guard the world of guilt; nor is even that mine, but lo! the dread stars search it from end to end, and gaze upon me. Does the proud ruler of Olympus spy out my strength? Mine is the prison-house, now broken, of the Gigantes, and of the Titanes, eager to force their way to the world above, and his own unhappy sire [Kronos] : why thus cruelly doth he forbid me to enjoy my mournful leisure and this untranquil peace, and to hate the light I lost? I will open all my kingdoms, if such by my pleasure, and veil Hyperion [Helios the sun] with a Stygian sky. I will not send the Arcadian [Hermes] up to the gods--why doth he come and go on errands between realm and realm?--and I will keep both the sons of Tyndareus [i.e. the Dioskouroi who divided their days equally between Olympos and the Underworld]. And why do I break Ixion on the greedy whirling of the wheel? Why do the waters not wait for Tantalus? Must I so oft endure the profanation of Chaos by living strangers? The rash ardour of Pirithous provoked me, and Theseus, sworn comrade of his daring friend [the pair attempted to abduct Persephone], and fierce Alcides [Herakles], when the iron threshold of Cerberus’ gate fell silent, its guardian removed. It shames me too, alas! how Tartarus opened a way to the Odyrsian plaint [Orpheus]; with my own eyes I saw the Eumenides [Erinyes] shed base tears at those persuasive strains, and the Sisters [Moirai, fates] repeat their allotted task; me too -, but the violence of my cruel law was stronger. Yet I have scarce ventured one stolen journey, nor was that to the stars on high, when I carried of my bride [Persephone] from the Sicilian mead: unlawfully, so they say, and forthwith comes an unjust decree from Jove [Zeus], and her mother [Demeter] cheats me of half a year. But why do I tell all this: Go, Tisiphone, avenge the abode of Tartarus! if ever thou hast wrought monsters fierce and strange, bring forth some ghastly horror, huge and unwonted, such as the sky hath never yet beheld, such as I may marvel at and thy Sisters [the Moirai] envy. Ay, and the brothers [Polyneikes and Eteokles] rush to slay each other in exultant combat; let there be one [Tydeus] who in hideous, bestial savagery shall gnaw his foeman’s head, and one [king Kreon] who shall bar the dead from the funeral fire and pollute the air with naked corpses; let the fierce Thunderer [Zeus] feast his eyes on that! Moreover, lest their fury harm my realms alone, seek one who shall make war against he gods [Kapaneus] and with smoking shield repel the fiery brand and Jove’s [Zeus’] own wrath. I will have all men fear to disturb black Tartarus no less than to set Pelion on top of leafy Ossa.’ He finished, and long since was the gloomy palace quaking at his words, and his own land and that which presses on it from above were rocking: no more mightily does Jupiter [Zeus] sway the heaven with his nod, and bow the starry poles. But what shall be thy [Amphiaraus’] doom,’ he cries, `who rushest headlong through the empty realm on a path forbidden?’ As he threatens, the other draws nigh, on foot now and shadowy to view, his armour growing faint, yet in his lifeless face abides the dignity of augurship inviolate, and on his brow remains the fillet dim to behold, and in his hand is a branch of dying olive. `If it be lawful and right for holy Manes (Shades) to make utterence here, O thou to all men the great Finisher, but to me, who once knew causes and beginnings, Creator also! remit, I pray, thy threatenings and thy fevered heart, nor deem worthy of thy wrath one who is but a man and fears thy laws; ‘tis for no Herculean plunder--such wars are not for me--, nor for a forbidden bride--believe these emblems--that I dare to enter Lethe: let not Cerberus flee into his cave, nor Proserpine [Persephone] shudder at my chariot. I, once the best beloved of augurs at Apollo’s shrines, call empty Chaos to bear witness--for what power to receive an oath has Apollo here?--for no crime do I suffer this unwonted fate, nor have I deserved to be thus torn from the kindly light of day; the urn of the Dictean judge doth know it, and Minos can discern the truth. Sold by the treachery of my wife [Eriphyle] for wicked gold, I joined the Argive host, not unwitting - hence this crowd of new-slain ghosts thou seest, and the victims also of this right hand; in a sudden convulsion of the earth--my mind still shrinks in horror--thy darkness swallowed me up from the midst of thousands . . . content am I to receive my Shade [Amphiaraus was not yet dead but dropped alive into Haides], nor remember my tripods any more. For what avails thee the use of prescient augury, when the Parcae [Moirai, fates] spin thy commands? Nay, be thou softened, and prove more merciful than the gods. If ever my accursed wife come hither, reserve for her thy deadly torments : she is more worthy of thy wrath, O righteous lord!’ He [Haides] accepts his prayer, and is indignant that he yields." Statius, Thebaid 11. 410 ff : "Thrice from the regions of doom thundered their [the Erinyes'] impatient monarch [Haides], and shook the depths of the earth [at the commencement of the War of Thebes] . . . The king of Tartarus [Haides] himself orders the gates to be set open [i.e. to receive the legions of the slain]." Statius, Thebaid 11. 444 ff : "The Warden of the Larvae (Shades) [lord Haides] and the third heir of the world, after the lot’s unkind apportioning, leapt down from his chariot and grew pale, for he was come to Tartarus and heaven was lost for ever." Statius, Silvae 3. 3. 21 (trans. Mozley) (Roman poetry C1st A.D.) : "Let him [the shade of a father] come, and approach the awful throne of the silent monarch [Haides] and pay his last due of gratitude and anxiously request for his son a long life." Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 3. 380 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Celaeneus [the Black, Haides], sitting sable-shrouded and sword in hand, cleanses the innocent from their error." Apuleius, The Golden Ass 7. 24 ff (trans. Walsh) (Roman novel C2nd A.D.) : "I was pulled out of the hands of Orcus [Haides] [that is, saved from death]." Tryphiodorus, The Taking of Ilias 568 ff (trans. Mair) (Greek poet C5th A.D.) : "And Haides shuddered [at the slaughter of the Sack of Troy] and looked forth from his seat under earth, afraid lest in the great anger of Zeus Hermes, conductor of souls, should bring down all the race of men." Nonnus, Dionysiaca 36. 97 ff (trans. Rouse) (Greek epic C5th A.D.) : "Then Zeus Khthonios (Zeus of the Underworld) [Haides] rumbled hearing the noise of the heavenly fray above [as Poseidon and Apollon entered battle when the gods took sides in the war of Dionysos and his army against the Indians]; he feared that the Earthshaker [Poseidon], beating and lashing the solid ground with the earthquake-shock of his waves, might lever out of gear the whole universe with his trident, might move the foundations of the abysm below and show the forbidden sight of earth’s bottom, might burst all the veins of the subterranean channels and pour his water away into the pit of Tartaros, to flood the mouldering gates of the lower world. So great was the din of the gods in conflict, and the trumpets of the underworld added their noise." Nonnus, Dionysiaca 36. 200 ff : "[During the War of Dionysos against the Indians :] Lethe was choked with that great multitude of corpses brought low and scattered on every side. Aides heaved up his bar in the darkness, and opened his gates wider for the common carnage; as they descended into the pit the banks of Kharon’s river echoed the rumblings of Tartaros." Nonnus, Dionysiaca 12. 213 ff : "[Dionysos transforms his dead friend Ampelos into a grape vine at death :] `For you Haides himself has become merciful, for you Persephone herself has changed her hard temper, and saved you alive in death for brother Bakkhos. You did not die . . . You are still alive, my boy, even if you died." Stesichorus, Fragment 232 (trans. Campbell, Vol. Greek Lyric III) (C7th to 6th B.C.) : "Mourning and wailing are the portion of Hades." Aeschylus, Seven Against Thebes 864 ff (trans. Weir Smyth) (Greek tragedy C5th B.C.) : "Cry out the awful hymn of the Erinys [i.e. the shrieks and cries of the grieving women] and thereafter sing the hated victory song of Aides [i.e. the funeral dirge]." Plato, Republic 427b (trans. Shorey) (Greek philosopher C4th B.C.) : “The burial of the dead and the services we must render to the dwellers in the world beyond to keep them gracious.” [I.e. the gods of the dead and the ghosts of men.] Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 5. 69. 5 (trans. Oldfather) (Greek historian C1st B.C.) : "Of Haides it is said that he laid down the rules which are concerned with burials and funerals and the honours which are paid to the dead, no concern having been given to the dead before this time; and this is why tradition tells us that Haides is lord of the dead, since there were assigned to him in ancient times the first offices in such matters and the concern for them." Statius, Thebaid 12. 557 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The father of the Eumenides [i.e. Haides, father of the Erinyes] and the ferryman of Lethe’s stream [Kharon] debars them [i.e. the souls of the unburied] from the Stygian gate and keeps them hovering doubtfully between the worlds of heaven and hell (Erebus)."
I) NECROMANCY OF ODYSSEUS Odysseus was instructed in the art of necromancy by the witch Kirke so that he might commune with the prophetic ghost of the seer Teiresias. According to the author of the Odyssey the rites were performed on the borders of the Underworld. Later authors, however, say that Odysseus visited the Nekromanteion (Oracle of the Dead) at Cumae in southern Italy. Homer, Odyssey 10. 495 ff (trans. Shewring) (Greek epic C8th B.C.) : "[Kirke instructs Odysseus in necromancy, the summoning of ghosts :] `You must visit the house of dread Persephone and of Haides, and there seek counsel from the spirit of Theban Teiresias. The blind seer’s thought is wakeful still, for to him alone, even after death, Persephone has accorded wisdom; the other dead are but flitting shadows . . . And when you have sailed through the river Okeanos, you will see before you a marrow strand and he groves that are Persephone’s--the tall black poplars, the willows with their self-wasted fruit; then beach the vessel beside deep-eddying Okeanos and pass on foot to the dank domains of Haides. At the entrance there, the stream of Akheron is joined by the waters of Pyriphlegethon and a branch of Styx, Kokytos, and there is a rock where the two loud-roaring rivers meet. Then, lord Odysseus, you must do as I enjoin you; go forward, and dig a trench a cubit long and a cubit broad; go round this trench, pouring libation for all the dead, first with milk and honey, then with sweet wine, then with water; and sprinkle white barley-meal above. Then with earnest prayers to the strengthless presences of the dead you must promise that when you have come to Ithaka you will sacrifice in your palace a calfless heifer, the best you have, and will load a pyre with precious things; and that for Teiresias and no other you will slay, apart, a ram that is black all over, the choicest in all the flocks of Ithaka. When with these prayers you have made appeal to the noble nations of the dead, then you must sacrifice a ram and a black ewe; bend the victims' heads down towards Erebos, but turn your own head away and look towards the waters of the river. At this, the souls of the dead and gone will come flocking there. With commanding voice you must call your cmorades to flay and burn the two sheep that now lie before them, killed by your own ruthless blade, and over them to pray to the gods, to resistless Haides and dread Persephone. As for yourself, draw the keen sword from beside your thight; then, sitting down, hold back the strengthles presences of the dead from drawing nearer to the blood until you have questioned Teiresias. Then, King Odysseus, the seer will come to you very quickly, to prophesy the path before you, the long stages of your travel, and how you will reach home at last over the teeming sea."
Homer, Odyssey 11. 10 ff : "[Odysseus travels to the Underworld to consult the ghost of the seer Teiresias :] The vessel came to the bounds of eddying Okeanos, where lie the land and city of the Kimmeroi, covered with mist and cloud. never does the resplendent sun look on this people with his beams . . . dismal gloom overhangs these wretches always. Arriving there, we beached the vessel, took out the sheep and then walked onwards beside the stream of Okeanos until we came to the place that Kirke had told us of. There, Perimedes and Eurylokhos seized the victims and held them fast, while I myself drew the keen sword from besie my thigh and cut a trench a cubit long and a cubit broad. Round it I poured a libation for all the dead, first with milk and honey, then with sweet wine, then with water; over this I sprinkled white barley-meal. Then with earnest prayers to the strengthless presences of the dead I promised that when I came to Ithaka I would sacrifice in my palace a calfless heifer, the best I had, and would load a pyre with precious things; and that for Teiresias and no other I would slay, apart, a ram that was black all over, the choicest in all the flocks of Ithaka. When with my prayers and invocations I had called on the peoples of the dead, I seized the victims and cut their throats over the trench. The dark blood flowed, and the souls od the dead and gone came flocking upwards from Erebos--brides and unmarried youths, old men who had suffered much, tender girls with the heart's distress still keen, troops of warriors wounded with brazen-pointed spears, men slain in battle with blood-stained armour still upon them. With unearthly cries, from every quarter, they came crowding about the trench until pale terror began to master me. Then with urgent voice I called my comrades to flay and burn the two sheep that now lay before them, killed by my own ruthless blade, and over them to pray to the gods, to resistless Haides and dread Persephone. As for myself, I drew the keen sword from beside my thigh, seated myself and held back the strengthless preseences of the dead from drawing nearer to the blood before I had questioned Teiresias." Homer, Odyssey 11. 210 & 11. 386 : "[Odysseus performs the necromantic rites and is approached by the ghost of his mother. He questions her :] `Is this some wraith that august Persephone has sent me to increase my sorrowing and my tears?’ So I spoke, and the queen my mother answered me : `Alas, my child, ill-fated beyond all other mortals, this is no mockery of Persephone’s; it is all men’s fortune when they die. The sinews no longer hold flesh and bones together; these are all prey to the resistless power of fire when once the life has left the white bones; the soul takes wing as a dream takes wing, and thereafter hovers to and fro . . .' Meanwhile there appeared a whole company of women [before Odysseus], sent by Persephone the august; and these were the wives or the daughters of great men. They gathered flocking round the dark blood [of the sacrificed black sheep] all together. So they came forward one after another, and each in turn told me her lineage, for I left none of them unquestioned . . . Then, when chaste Persephone had dispersed this way and that the souls of those many women, there came before me in bitter sorrow the soul of Agamemon . . . Then there came before me the soulds of Akhilleus and Patroklos, of noble Antilokhos and of Aias . . . The soul of the fleet-foot son of Peleus went pacing forth over the field of asphodel . . . Other souls of the dead and gone still stood there sorrowfully, each of them questioning me on whatever touched them the most . . . Indeed I might then have seen [more of] those men of past days I wished to see, but before I could, there came before me with hideous clamour the thronging multitudes of the dead, and ashly terror seized hold of me. I feared that august Persephone might send against me from Haides’ house the Gorgoneion (the gorgon's head) of some grisly monster. I made for my ship at once, telling my comrades to step aboard and to loose the cables." Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca E7. 7 & 34 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "He [Odysseus] sailed Okeanos, and offered sacrifices to the souls, and by Kirke's advice consulted the soothsayer Tiresias, and beheld the souls both of heroes and of heroines. He also looked on his mother Antikleia and Elpenor, who had died of a fall in the house of Kirke . . . [Upon returning to Ithaka, Odysseus slew the suitors and then :] After sacrificing to Haides, and Persephone, and Teiresias, he journeyed on foot through Epiros, and came to the Thesprotians, and having offered sacrifice according to the directions of the soothsayer Teiresias, he propitiated Poseidon." Lycophron, Alexandra 697 ff (trans. Mair) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.) : "The grove of Obrimo [i.e. the grove of Persephone near Avernos in Italia], Kore (Maiden) who dwells beneath the earth, and Pyriphleges (the Fiery Stream), where the difficult Polydegmon hill [in Italy] stretches its head to the sky . . . and the lake Aornos [i.e. lake Avernus near Cumae in Italy] rounded with a noose and the waters of Kokytos wild and dark, stream of black Styx . . . he [Odysseus] shall offer up a gift to Daeira [Persephone] and her consort, fastening his helmet to the head of a pillar."
II) NECROMANCY OF TEIRESIAS In Statius' Thebaid the seer Teiresias performs necromancy to commune with the dead when King Oidipous would learn the reason for the plague inflicting Thebes. Seneca, Oedipus 395 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "[The seer Teiresias declares that he will perform necromancy :] `We must unseal the earth, must implore the implacable divinity of Dis [Haides], must draw forth hither the people [ghosts] of infernal Styx.'" Statius, Thebaid 4. 410 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "He [the seer Teiresias] prepares the rites of Lethe [i.e. nekromankia], and makes ready beforehand to evoke the monarch [Haides] sunk below the confines of [the river] Ismenos where it mingles with the deep, and makes purgation all around with the torn entrails of sheep and the strong smell of sulphur, and with fresh herbs and the long mutterings of prayer . . . [Teiresias] bids the dark-fleeced sheep and black oxen be set before him . . . Then he entwined their fierce horns with wreaths of dusky hue, handling them himself, and first at the edge of that well-known wood [i.e. one sacred to the goddess Hekate] he nine times spills the lavish draughts of Bacchus into a hollowed trench, and gifts of vernal milk and Attic rain [i.e. honey] and propitiatory blood to the Shades below; so much is poured out as the dry earth will drink. Then they roll tree trunks thither, and the sad priest bids there be three altar-fires for Hecate and three for the maidens born of cursed Acheron [the Erinyes]; for thee, lord of Avernus [Haides], a heap of pinewood though sunk into the ground yet towers high into the air; next to this an altar of lesser bulk is raised to Ceres of the Underworld [Persephone]; in front and on every side the cypress of lamentation intertwines them. And now, their lofty heads marked with the sword and the pure sprinkled meal, the cattle fell under the stroke; then the virgin Manto [daughter of Teiresias], catching the blood in bowls, makes first libation, and moving thrice round all the pyres, as her holy sire commands, offers the half-dead tissues and yet living entrails, nor delays to set the devouring fire to the dark foliage. And when Tiresias heard the branches crackling in the flames and the grim piles roaring--for the burning heat surges before his face, and the fiery vapour fills the hollows of his eyes--he exclaimed, and the pyres trembled, and the flames cowered at his voice : `Abodes of Tartarus and awful realm of insatiable Mors [Thanatos, death], and thou, most cruel of the brothers [Haides], to whom the Shades are given to serve thee, and the eternal punishments of the damned obey thee, and the palace of the underworld, throw open in answer to my knowing the silent places and empty void of stern Persephone, and send forth the multitude that lurk in hollow night.'" Statius, Thebaid 4. 520 ff : "[The blind Teiresias while performing necromancy declares :] `Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone].'"
III) NECROMANCY OF AESON & ALKIMEDE Aeson and his wife, the Thessalian witch Alkimede, perform necromancy to learn the fate of their son, the hero Jason, and to bring down the curse of the dead upon King Pelias, who is plotting their death. Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 1. 730 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Alkimede the mother of Jason, who has departed on his quest for the Golden Fleece, uses necromancy to summon the ghosts of the dead :] Unto the lord of Tartarus [Haides] and unto the Stygian ghosts was Alcimede [i.e. the mother of Jason] bringing holy offerings in fear for her mighty son [Jason, if Shades summoned forth might give her surer knowledge. Even Aeson [her husband] himself, who shares her anxiety but who hides such unmanly fears in his heart, yields and is led by his wife. In a trench stands blood and plenteous offering to hidden Phlegethon and with fierce cries the aged witch calls upon her departed ancestors and the grandson of great Pleione [i.e. Hermes, guide of the dead]. And now at the sound of the spell rose a face, insubstantial, and [the ghost of] Kretheus [the father of Aeson] gazed upon his mournful son and daughter-in-law, and when he had sipped the blood he began to utter these words . . . [The ghost tells him that Jason is safe, but King Pelias is plotting Aeson’s death.] He [Aeson] returns to the holy rites [i.e. the necromancy]. Beneath the gloom of an ancient cypress, squalid and ghastly with darksome hue, a bull still stood, dark blue fillets on his horns, his brow rough with the foliage of yew; the beast too was downcast, panting and restless, and terrified at the sight of the shade. The witch [Alkimede], according to the custom of her evil race had kept him, chosen above all others, to use him now at last for these hellish practises. When Aeson saw that the bull still remained at the hour of the awful rites unslain, he dooms him to death, and with one hand upon the horns of the fated victim speaks for the last time `O ye [ghost of Kretheus] who received from Jupiter [Zeus] your reign and the light of life not idly spent . . . my father, summoned forth from the shades to view my death and to endure again the forgotten sorrows of men on earth, O grant me entry to the abode of quiet [Haides], and may the victim that I send before me win favour for me in your dwelling. Thou, O maid [Dike lady Justice], that dost report guilty deeds to Jove [Zeus], who lookest down upon earth with unerring eyes, ye avenging goddesses [Erinyes], thou Divine Law, and thou Retribution (Poena), aged mother of the Furiai [Erinyes], enter into the sinful palace of the king [Pelias], and bring upon him your fierce torches. Let accursed fear ravish his maddened heart; nor let him deem that my son alone will come with grim weapons in his bark . . . [and take vengeance on the king.]' Then he appeased the goddess of triple form [i.e. Hekate, goddess of earth-bound ghosts], and with his last sacrifice offers a prayer to the Stygian abodes, rehearsing backward a spell soon, soon to prove persuasive; for without that no thin shade will the dark ferryman [Kharon] take away, and bound they stand at the mouth of Orcus [Haides]."
IV) NECROMANCY OF MEDEA Witches such as Medea were practitioners of the necromantic rites. Medea employs these powers in a spell to restore youth to Aeson. Ovid, Metamorphoses 7. 242 ff (trans. Melville) (Roman epic C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "[Medea uses her magic to restore Aeson's youth :] Two turf altars she built [for the ritual], the right to Hecate, the left to Juventas [Hebe, the goddess of Youth], wreathed with the forest’s mystic foliage, and dug two trenches in the ground beside and then performed her rites. Plunging a knife into a black sheep’s throat she drenched the wide ditches with blood; next from a chalice poured a stream of wine and from a second chalice warm frothing milk and, chanting magic words, summoned the Deities of Earth (Numina Terrena) and prayed the sad shades’ monarch (Rex Umbrarum) [Haides] and his stolen bride [Persephone] that, of their mercy, from old Aeson’s frame they will not haste to steal the breath of life . . . [and she then applied her potions to the body of the man.] And Aeson woke and marvelled as he saw his prime restored of forty years before."
V) THE NECROMANCY OF WITCHES Not only Medea and Alkimede (above) but witches in general were regarded as practitioners of the necromantic rites. Statius, Thebaid 3. 140 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The gloomy councils of the Shades complain [at being summoned from Haides by a witch], and black Avernus’ sire [lord Haides] waxes indignant
VI) THE ORACLES OF THE DEAD The Oracle of the Dead or Nektromanteion in Thesprotia was a shrine dedicated to the gods Haides and Persephone. The oracles of the daimones Amphiaraus and Trophonios in Boiotia were also necromantic in nature. I) ERINYES & THE VENGEAFUL GHOST Aeschylus, Libation Bearers 380 ff (trans. Weir Smyth) (Greek tragedy C5th B.C.) : "[A supplication to the ghost of the murdered king :] This has pierced the earth and reached your [the ghost's] ear as if it were an arrow. O Zeus, O Zeus [here Haides, the Zeus of the underworld], who send long-deferred retribution up from below [i.e. in the form of the Erinyes] onto the reckless and wicked deeds done by the hands of mortals." Seneca, Hercules Furens 100 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "Begin, [Erinyes] handmaids of Dis [Haides], make haste to brandish the burning pine." Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 3. 380 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "We [the souls of the dead] are not dissolved into the breezes or into mere bones at the last: anger abides and grief endures. Thereafter when they are come to the throne of Awful Jove [Haides] and have set forth all the sorrowful story of their dreadful end, the gate of death is opened for them and they may return a second time [i.e. to the earth as vengeful ghosts]; one of the Sisters [i.e. the Erinyes] is given them as a companion, and they range together over lands and seas. Each involved in penalties the guilty souls of his own foes; they rack them with various terrors after their deserving. But those whose hands have dripped with blood unwillingly--or were it cruel mischance, though nigh to guilt, that swept away the wretches - these men their own minds harry in divers ways, and their own deeds vex the doers; languid now and ventureless they decline into tears and spiritless alarms and sickly sloth [i.e. in their grief at having accidentally killed someone]: such thou dost here behold . . . Celaeneus [Haides], sitting sable-shrouded and sword in hand, cleanses the innocent from their error, and remitting their fault unwinds a spell to appease the angry Shades. He it was who taught me [the seer Mopsos] what lustrations should be made to the slain, he of his good pleasure opened the earth to Erebus below. When therefore the orient sets the crimson seas aflame, do thou summon thy comrades to sacrifice, and bring two steers to the mighty gods; for me were it wrong meanwhile to approach your gathering, until I spend the night in cleansing prayers [i.e. in preparation for the ceremony of purification to cleanse a man of the crime of murder, which drives away the haunting Erinyes and the avenging ghost of the dead]." Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Haides commands the Erinys :] `Go, Tisiphone, avenge the abode of Tartarus! if ever thou hast wrought monsters fierce and strange, bring forth some ghastly horror, huge and unwonted, such as the sky hath never yet beheld, such as I may marvel at and thy Sisters [the Moirai] envy.'"
II) VENGEAFUL GHOSTS ON THE BATTLEFIELD Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 4. 258 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "At their [ghosts of the men slain by the wrestler Ampycus] entreaty father Tartarus [Haides] sends forth in a hollow cloud the Shades of the slain to view at last the well-earned retribution [Ampycus’ own death]; the mountain-tops grow black with them." Statius, Thebaid 11. 410 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The king of Tartarus [Haides] himself orders the gates to be set open [ready to receive the legions of newly dead from war], and the Ogygian Manes (Ghosts) to attend their kindred’s monstrous deeds [in the internecine War of the Seven Against Thebes]. Seated upon their native hills they pollute the day with grisly band, and rejoice that their own crimes should be surpassed."
III) CURSE OF THE ERINYES Homer, Iliad 9. 450 ff (trans. Lattimore) (Greek epic C8th B.C.) : "I [Phoinix] first left Hellas . . . running from the hatred of Ormenos' son Amyntor, my father; who hated me for the sake of a fair-haired mistress. For he made love to her himself, and dishonoured his own wife, my mother; who was forever taking my knees and entreating me to lie with this mistress instead so that she would hate the old man. I was persuaded and did it; and my father when he heard of it straightway called down his curses, and invoked against me the dreaded Erinyes that I might never have any son born of my seed to dandle on my knees; and the divinities, Zeus Khthonios (of the underworld) [Haides] and Persephone the honoured goddess, accomplished his curses." Homer, Iliad 9. 565 ff : "Meleagros lay mulling his heart-sore anger, raging by reason of his mother’s [Althaia’s] curses, which she called down from the gods upon him, in deep grief for the death of her brother, and many times beating with her hands on the earth abundant she called on Haides and on honoured Persephone, lying at length along the ground, and the tears were wet on her bosom, to give death to her son; and Erinys, the mist-walking, she of the heart without pity, heard her out of the dark places." Apollonius Rhodius, Argonautica 3. 401 ff (trans. Rieu) (Greek epic C3rd B.C.) : "[Khalkiope addresses her sister Medea :] `I implore you . . . not to stand by while they [her sons, who are accompanying the Argonauts] are mercilessly done to death. If you do so, may I die with my dear sons and haunt you afterwards from Haides like an avenging Erinys (Fury) . . . ’ [Medea replies to Khalkiope:] `Sister you left me speechless when you talked of curses and avenging Erinyes (Furies).'" Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 7. 311 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Medea] wearies heaven above and Tartarus beneath with her complaints [about her love for Jason]; she beats upon the ground, and murmuring into her clutching hands calls on the Queen of Night [Hekate] and Dis [Haides] to bring her aid by granting death, and to send him who is the cause of her madness down with her to destruction." Statius, Thebaid 1. 46 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Oidipous blinded himself upon learning that he had slain his father and married his mother. His sons then treated him with cruel disdain and so he summons the Erinyes to punish them :] Oedipus with avenging hand probed deep his sinning eyes and sunk his guilty shame in eternal night . . . yet with unwearied wings the fierce daylight of the mind hovers around him, and the avenging Dirae [Erinyes] of his crimes assail his heart. Then he displays to heaven those empty orbs, the cruel, pitiful punishment of his own lie, and with blood-stained hands beats upon the hollow earth, and in dire accents utters this prayer : `Gods [Haides, Persephone and the Erinyes] who hold sway over guilty souls and over Tartarus crowded with the damned, and thou O Styx, whom I behold, ghastly in thy shadowy depths, and thou Tisiphone, so oft the object of my prayer, be favourable now, and further my unnatural wish . . . Sightless though I was and driven from my throne, my sons, on whatever couch begotten, attempted not to give me guidance or consolation in my grief . . . and they mock my blindness, they abhor their father’s groans . . . Do thou at least, my due defender, come hither, and begin a work of vengeance that will blast their seed for ever!'" Suidas s.v. Persephone (trans. Suda On Line) (Byzantine Greek lexicon C10th A.D.) : "Persephone : An Underworld spirit (katageios daimon). Elektra says : `O house of Haides and Persephone! O Hermes of the Underworld and holy Ara (Curse) and divine Erinnyes (Furies)! You who watch over those dying unjustly and those being robbed of a marriage bed: Come! Help avenge the murder of our father!'"
IV) CURSE-OATHS BOUND BY HAIDES & THE ERINYES When Haides was invoked in an oath, the connotation was "let me be cursed, if I dare to break the oath." Apollonius Rhodius, Argonautica 2. 259 ff (trans. Rieu) (Greek epic C3rd B.C.) : "[King Phineos swears an oath to the Argonauts :] `By the Powers below [i.e. Haides, Persephone and the Erinyes]--and may they blast me if I die forsworn--that you will not incur the wrath of Heaven by helping me.'" Seneca, Oedipus 247 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "[King Oidipous swears an oath :] `Now at Heaven’s command let the crime be expiated [i.e. the murder of king Laios]. Whoever of the gods dost look with favour upon kingdoms--thou [Zeus], thou whose are the laws of the swift-revolving heavens; and thou [Helios the sun], greatest glory of the unclouded sky . . . and thou, his sister [Selene the moon] . . . thou [Poseidon] whom the winds obey . . . and thou [Haides] who dost allot homes devoid of light--do ye all attend: Him by whose hand Laïus fell may no peaceful dwelling, no friendly household gods, no hospitable land in exile entertain.'" Seneca, Oedipus 868 ff : "[Oidipous curses himself when he learns that he has killed his father and married his mother :] `Yawn, earth! And do thou [Haides], king of the dark world, ruler of shades, to lowest Tartarus hurl this unnatural interchange ‘twixt brood and stock.'"
HELM OF HAIDES The magical helm of Haides was crafted for the god by the elder Kyklopes to use as a weapon in the Titan-War. It bestowed complete invisibility upon the wearer (making him indiscernable even to gods). SCEPTRE OF HAIDES Haides wielded a royal sceptre, a magical death-dealing staff which could sunder the earth, creating a passage between the world of the living and the world of the dead. PALACE OF HAIDES The golden palace of Haides lay in the dark, dank realms of the Underworld. THRONE OF HAIDES Haides sat dispensing fate upon the newly dead, from a golden throne in the hall of his palace, surrounded by the three Judges. KEYS OF HAIDES The Gates of Haides were securely locked to prevent the escape of souls. Haides (or his doorman Aiakos) held the golden keys. HOUND OF HAIDES The gate of the house of Haides was guarded by the ferocious three-headed, monster-dog Kerberos. [See KERBEROS] ORCHARDS OF HAIDES Near the palace of Haides lay the god's famed orchard of pomegranate trees. From one of these came the fruit which trapped Persephone in the Underworld (permanently but for a special dispensation from Zeus which allowed her to return to the world of the living for part of the year). CATTLE OF HAIDES King Haides possessed a herd of immortal, sable-black cattle which roamed the asphodel fields of Haides under the care of the daimon herdsman Menoetes
Moe Epsilon, I hope you have a Merry Christmas and hope your day is full of the true spirit of the day. Plus, good food, good family and good times. :) Have a Great Day! :) - Neutralhomer • Talk • 07:32, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
Spread the joy of Christmas by adding {{subst:User:Neutralhomer/MerryChristmas}} to their talk page with a friendly message.
Well under my username SWD316, I had 4 attempts between 2005 and that fifth attempt with Moe Epsilon in 2006. It was a rather unpleasant experience, with one user creating around 30 sockpuppets to disrupt my RFAs and to vandalize to the point they had to keep being restarted (mostly out of frustration, myself). Sure, I'd like to run again some day, but after all of that mess and then a continuing career at Wikipedia, it's almost to the point where I've gained too many detractors to be successful. I have a (very) tentative date to give it a try: on the ten-year anniversary of me registering on Wikipedia, on July 10, 2015. Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:19, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
Hi Moe, I noticed you've been classifying using STiki today. I similarly noticed that your revert percentages were quite low (relative to your own average, and that of the tool in general). Any intuition on what you've been seeing? I guess it is holiday break for many, perhaps the vandalism rates have fallen as a result? Thanks, West.andrew.g (talk) 02:06, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
Hey Andrew. I noticed the amount being particularly low too, and I stopped using it a while ago once I got to "edits from 100 days ago". I haven't even seen a report on STiki from today; the latest entry was from 1 day ago. My intuition is telling me either a group of users are doing a high-speed vandalism work as it's coming (using STiki or maybe another tool), or that vandalism isn't just very high right now. Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:20, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
Congratulations from STiki!
The Gold STiki Barnstar of Merit
Congratulations, Moe Epsilon! You're receiving this barnstar of merit because you recently crossed the 25,000 classification threshold using STiki.
We thank you both for your contributions to Wikipedia at-large and your use of the tool.
Hi. I added the line to the article about the Cercopes because I had read about the detail in at least two separate sources on the myth, and believed it contributed to the general tone of their story (goofy and slightly bawdy). - Salkafar 1/1/'13 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.85.98.164 (talk) 23:47, 1 January 2013 (UTC)
I just noticed, you are implying that my writing on one of the serbian politicians Čedomir Jovanović s' wiki page is not constructive, kind sir, i beg to differ. I just wrote the statistics that are based on true and real facts, and i wrote them as they were displayed on the Serbian national magazine "Novosti". I am not the one responsible for the Serbian People s' negative opinion towards him, i am just writing the facts, and the facts are, that according to the enquête held in Serbia, over 90% of the population had negative opinion on Čedomir Jovanović, and i passed the truth to the wikipedia.
i think that wikipedia is a free page, on which the free speech is a necessity in order to bring true and correct information to any,and all viewers. I hope you can reverse you decision about deleting my fact on this politician s' wiki page, and restore it the way it used to be, thank you.
I looked over the revert I did and I am inclined to keep it exactly the way it is. Unless you have a source as to an opinion poll or a similar method of determining opinion in Serbia, proving that a negative view is held by 90% of the population is "true and real", then your edit can not be restored. You will also note, that Wikipedia is not a place to exercise a freedom of speech, and Wikipedia does not acknowledge any said right. Article content is based on verifiable and reliable sources, not through what is considered a necessity. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:34, 2 January 2013 (UTC)
Thanks for your replay, i will not pursue this anymore. after all, 90% already hate him, so there is no point to post it on wiki,as people are already aware of this fact, thanks anyway. Ninoslav — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.223.110.216 (talk) 15:48, 3 January 2013 (UTC)
Miz Grand Slam
Hey, Moe:
As someone who has been a main editor on the Grand Slam Championship page, I would like to run something by you.
When you click on the MORE tab on Miz's bio, you'll see that Miz is billed as a Grand Slam Champion, having won the WWE, I-C, U.S. and Tag Team titles.
I would think that this is the long elusive source that WWE counts the U.S. Title as part of the Slam (in the #3 slot equal to the European and Hardcore titles).
I think it would be apparent that WWE either wrote this bio for Miz or at minimum collaborated with ION to put it together.
Anyway, I'd like you to give it a look-see, because if this flies, it has all sorts of ramifications, as Edge, Dolph Ziggler, and Chris Benoit would then also be U.S. title version Slam winners (so could Ric Flair and Steve Austin if you want to throw in their WCW reigns with the belt...WWE makes no differentiation amongst reigns, they just list whether you held the belt or not.)
Hey Vjmlhds. I would say the source is fine, but the Grand Slam (and Triple Crown) articles have some issues with sourcing and prose in general that have to be dealt with. I'd rather see the article aplit (not separate articles, two lists on the same artile) from one list of all definitions to a list based on the original definition, then separate lists (on the same article) based on reliable sources that change the definition. Regards, — MoeEpsilon05:11, 4 January 2013 (UTC)
I amended "folk" to "filk" because they are separate styles of music - Duncan and I both have songs published in the "Old Grey Wassail Test" http://www.lxnen.com/rogerbeccon/B/3comealong.html , which is a book of filk songs written by British SF fans in the 1980s and published by Beccon Publications (The word "filk" was originally a typo for "folk" from an old SF convention programme, but the accidental neologism was gleefully seized upon as a handy label to distinguish the styles - back in the day, filk music was originally "folky" in style, but nowadays filk can be written in any musical style.
Thanks for the message. Sorry, reverting and making sure editors aren't being misleading with their edits can be difficult, especially when the correct edit is intended to be a typographical error. Regards, — MoeEpsilon15:08, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
Thanks for the messages guys. I got one eye I can see perfectly from, so I guess that's enough to contribute with now. :) Regards, — MoeEpsilon19:30, 2 February 2013 (UTC)
Hi when I created a profile in order to edit a page, I noticed that my old school's page had been edited by you - apparently to remove some racial slurs about gypsies - which in turn seem to have come from my own IP address.
I was horrified when I read the edits and assume that these were made by my teenage son, with whom I shall be having a frank conversation when he returns from school.
I also removed a reference (presumably to a current pupil or staff member) which was pornographic.
Here's a kitten for you, from a newbie wiki-editor.
Thanks for the kitten! Thanks for keeping an eye on Wikipedia articles, it's appreciated of new editors and readers to monitor the site. I'll keep vigilant. :) Regards, — MoeEpsilon
Truthifarianism
Hi Moe,
I'm confused why you undid my edit of adding Truthifarianism as a branch of Atheistic Satanism. It is indeed a real religion I assure you, and I thought that my contribution would help inform those that were curious about it. If I wrote it wrong/offensively I'd like to know so I can rewrite the description without offending anyone. Please get back to me.
Thanks
MrGrimGamer (talk) 02:51, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
What I first saw was the accidental test media button you pressed, placing a test image image, which is the first reason. The second reason was that your paragraph on Truthifarianism is entirely unsourced and just at a glance (with no reference), no one can tell whether it is factually accurate without one. Try re-adding it with a reference next time if you can find such a reliable source. Regards, — MoeEpsilon11:50, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
Aqua Adventure
Hi Moe,
I'm confused why you undid my edit of adding information to the Aqua Adventure page. It is indeed a real religion I assure you, and I thought that my contribution would help inform those that were curious about it. If I wrote it wrong/offensively I'd like to know so I can rewrite the description without offending anyone. Please get back to me.
Thanks
Jesus — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.136.175.109 (talk) 05:24, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) I get the feeling that you just copied MrGrimGamer's statement and modified it, even though your edit has nothing to do with religion. Anyway, Moe undid it because you were not being neutral, and stating stuff that is unsourced. If you'd like to say stuff like that there's only 2 slides, or that'd you'd burn to a crisp since umbrellas need to be reserved, say it in a review of the park, not here. ZappaOMati05:39, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
Round 1 is now over. The top 64 scorers have progressed to round 2, where they have been randomly split into eight pools of eight. At the end of April, the top two from each pool, as well as the 16 highest scorers from those remaining, will progress to round 3. Commiserations to those eliminated; if you're interested in still being involved in the WikiCup, able and willing reviewers will always be needed, and if you're interested in getting involved with other collaborative projects, take a look at the WikiWomen's Month discussed below.
Round 1 saw 21 competitors with over 100 points, which is fantastic; that suggests that this year's competition is going to be highly competative. Our lower scores indicate this, too: A score of 19 was required to reach round 2, which was significantly higher than the 11 points required in 2012 and 8 points required in 2011. The score needed to reach round 3 will be higher, and may depend on pool groupings. In 2011, 41 points secured a round 3 place, while in 2012, 65 was needed. Our top three scorers in round 1 were:
Miyagawa (submissions), primarily for an array of did you knows and good articles, some of which were awarded bonus points.
Casliber (submissions), due in no small part to Canis Minor, a featured article awarded a total of 340 points. A joint submission with Keilana (submissions), this is the highest scoring single article yet submitted in this year's competition.
Other contributors of note include:
Sven Manguard (submissions), whose Portal:Massachusetts is the first featured portal this year. The featured portal process is one of the less well-known featured processes, and featured portals have traditionally had little impact on WikiCup scores.
Featured topics have still played no part in this year's competition, but once again, a curious contribution has been offered by The C of E (submissions): did you know that there is a Shit Brook in Shropshire? With April Fools' Day during the next round, there will probably be a good chance of more unusual articles...
March sees the WikiWomen's History Month, a series of collaborative efforts to aid the women's history WikiProject to coincide with Women's History Month and International Women's Day. A number of WikiCup participants have already started to take part. The project has a to-do list of articles needing work on the topic of women's history. Those interested in helping out with the project can find articles in need of attention there, or, alternatively, add articles to the list. Those interested in collaborating on articles on women's history are also welcome to use the WikiCup talk page to find others willing to lend a helping hand. Another collaboration currently running is an an effort from WikiCup participants to coordinate a number of Easter-themed did you know articles. Contributions are welcome!
A few final administrative issues. From now on, submission pages will need only a link to the article and a link to the nomination page, or, in the case of good article reviews, a link to the review only. See your submissions' page for details. This will hopefully make updating submission pages a little less tedious. If you are concerned that your nomination—whether it is at good article candidates, a featured process, or anywhere else—will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on Wikipedia:WikiCup/Reviews. Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. Good luck! If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove yourself from Wikipedia:WikiCup/Newsletter/Send. J Milburn (talk • email) and The ed17 (talk • email) J Milburn (talk) 01:00, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
Hello Moe Epsilon, Eduemoni has given you a shining smiling star! You see, these things promote WikiLove and hopefully this has made your day better. Spread the Shining Smiling Star whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or someone putting up with some stick at this time. Enjoy! Eduemoni↑talk↓04:12, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
Hey Moe, thanks for running the second round of notifications! I checked and found the server on which I'd been running the inactivity tasks on Labs had been deleted out from under me; I set up its dependencies and a new crontab on another server and all should be well now. I also took care of the issues you pointed out with removing inactive administrators; they were caused by my moving some common code to a common module and forgetting to update one reference. Cheers! — madman05:11, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
No problem! I re-added User:MacGyverMagic to the current round and gave him his second notification.[1] The bot removed him and I checked with an administrator to make sure he didn't have any deleted edits/logs in 2013 that would cause the bot to recognize them returning. Turns out it was just the bot and not MacGyverMagic, so he still needed the notification. Thanks for the updates, it appears to be running smoothly. :) Regards, — MoeEpsilon05:19, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
c_meindl (talk·contribs) 10:45, 6 February 2014 Taking a WikiPedia class and had to join a WikiProject. I am interested in supplementing song stubs and articles!
[[User:<Pushandturn>|<Pushandturn>]] ([[User talk:<Pushandturn>|talk]] · [[Special:Contribs/<Pushandturn>|contribs]]) 00:57, 1 May 2019 (UTC) optional: Im a longtime U2 fan and I went to the U2 360 tour and love sharing their music!
Thought you should know that User:Søren1997 is substantially copied from your userpage, including your bio, privileges, and various other stuff. I've pinged the user about it, but he hasn't edited in a week, so I thought I'd let you know in case you have any pressing concerns vis-à-vis misrepresentation or WP:COPYWITHIN. — PinkAmpers&(Je vous invite à me parler)09:16, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
@PinkAmpersand: I was kind of concerned about that, having noticed my self-created image was linking back to his userpage a while back. I was hoping he was simply using the design of my userpage to make his own, but he hasn't really edited it at all to make it his own. I'm going to go ahead and remove my biography and my privileges, because that could simply misrepresent who his real person is (and make it seem like I have two accounts or something). I'll also leave him a message about it. Regards, — MoeEpsilon16:04, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
You've been Wiki-Slapped!
John F. Lewis has given you a slap to the face! A slap to the face promotes WikiHate and hopefully this has ruined your day. Spread the WikiHate by giving someone else a slap to the face, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. John F. Lewis (talk) 18:00, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
Hi. The edit you reverted on Alger Hiss is back, with a single citation. Are you going to weigh in, or leave it be?
I was fairly satisfied with the old lede, which was written as a balanced (and hard won) compromise between a number of editors. The new edit is very POV. It's also the first time I seen someone use the POV tag because they felt that an article was TOO neutral and not slanted enough toward a single point of view. Regards, Joegoodfriend (talk) 20:58, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
Some of the material added seem to be quoted from within the article, so citations must exist for what he is saying. There's no need to edit war it since the old material is in the history, so if you can come to a compromise on the talk page about what should or shouldn't be in the lead, then either of you can alter it yourself. I'm not a subject-matter expert on Hiss; I faintly know of the topic and only reverted because he removed three citations and replaced it with no citations. Continue to gather consensus about what should be added, maybe start a request for comment there and let it run for a month to see what editors who visit the talk page say. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:37, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
Hi. So far, this is going pretty badly. I decided to try leaving the new text alone, and adding several points which were both factual and properly cited. In response, the other editor simply reverted everything I'd written. So I've created a Request for Comment on the Alger Hiss page. Any thoughts you may have are welcome. Regards, Joegoodfriend (talk) 18:03, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
Hello, Moe Epsilon. You have new messages at Mgreason's talk page. You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.
Hi Moe Epsilon! I'm the Wikipedian In Residence at the World Digital Library, a project of the Library of Congress and UNESCO. I'm recruiting Wikipedians who are passionate about history & culture to participate in improving Wikipedia using the WDL's vast free online resources. Participants can earn our awesome WDL barnstar and help to disseminate free knowledge from over 100 libraries in 7 different languages. Multilingual editing encouraged!!! But being multilingual is not a necessity to make this project a success. Please sign up to participate here. Thanks for editing Wikipedia and I look forward to working with you! EdwardsBot (talk) 14:27, 25 May 2013 (UTC)
Hey Moe! I'm so happy to see you signed up to join the project - welcome. You can dive into our to-do lists here. Be sure to watchlist your favorite to-do lists, as they will continue to grow as new content gets added to the WDL website. Also, you can always search the WDL website for something that you're interested in. And be sure to share your outcomes here. If I can help with anything just ask and welcome aboard! SarahStierch (talk) 14:06, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
Awesome. I don't have much time to help like I used to, but when I get some, I'll have a look through some to-do lists and start going. I had a look through them and some of it seems interesting, so I'll have a go at it. Regards, — MoeEpsilon22:07, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
Happy Memorial Day!
ZappaOMati is wishing you a Happy Memorial Day! On this day, we recognize our fellow countrymen who have fought our nation's battles for the past several hundred years, protecting our freedom and safety. We remember those who paid the ultimate price and we support those who continue to willingly sacrifice their safety for the sake of their country. Happy Memorial Day!
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Well the Embassy is for languages more than their location, but thank you, I don't see how that will help much. Also, I am highlighting editors when I link them in my userspace? That seems odd. I didn't think notifications worked in my userspace. Regards, — MoeEpsilon12:27, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
Oh, just re-read this since I replied and now realized what you said. Thanks, I'll have a look through it and fill in blanks when I'm done gathering information initially. Regards, — MoeEpsilon12:09, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
the original Palestine Post newspaper of May 16th 1948
hi
Could you please let me know where I can find an original whole copy of the front page of the Palestine Post newspaper of May 16th 1948.
It's for a very dear friend who collects such items.
thanks
Dalia - daltal@technion.ac.il — Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.68.29.135 (talk) 11:47, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
Not sure what brought you here on Wikipedia, but I think I can help. Go to this link. In the "Search for Publication" field, choose The Palestine Post. Below that, choose the start and end date for when you are searching. I entered a start and end date of May 16, 1948, and I got 25 results. There you may find what you are looking for. Regards, — MoeEpsilon11:57, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
Sfan00IMG: Clearing the images that need moving to Commons should be easy enough, but images that are fair use would need to be cleared by an administrator, since past versions of the image would need deleting (as an unused fair use image). Regards, — MoeEpsilon15:45, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
World Digital Library-Wikimedia Partnership Newsletter
Expand Wikipedia's free knowledge with WDL resources!
Hi Moe Epsilon! Thanks for participating in the World Digital Library-Wikimedia Partnership. Your contributions are important to improving Wikipedia! I wanted to share a few updates with you:
We have an easy way to now cite WDL resources. You can learn more about it on our news page, here.
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WDL project has new userbox for you to post on your userpage and celebrate your involvement. Soffredo created it, so please be sure to thank them on their talk page. You can find the userbox and add it to your page here.
Keep up the great work, and please contact me if you need anything! Thank you for all you do for free knowledge! EdwardsBot (talk) 16:36, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
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Thanks for the new page! I award you this Graphic Designer Barnstar :) I wish they had a "Pretty" barnstar, but alas we don't yet Dusti*Let's talk!*21:20, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
Hey, do you think you can help co-author an article on this CNN journalist? -- A Certain White Catchi? 20:53, 20 July 2013 (UTC)
とある白い猫: Sure, I can help out :) However, I am about to depart on a trip tomorrow and I cannot start anytime soon. I will be back at the end of the month, and then I'll start helping you with your article. Regards, — MoeEpsilon17:45, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
I have been posting all over WP, looking for information on User:Alabamaboy, why all information concerning him was erased but have had no success and so I added his username to missing Wikipedians list with as much information as I had been able to track down. Then, you revert my entry with the edit summary saying he hasn't disappeared.
Please provide some explanation about this to back up this assertion. By this, I mean information, rather than a flat contradiction. I'd rather not revert a revert so if I don't hear from you, I'll post on the article's Talk Page and if I get no response, I'll readd his username. Thanks. Newjerseyliz (talk) 15:10, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
User:Newjerseyliz: You should have probably checked first back at the former administrators talk page where you also posted about it, where I did reply. Again, he is not missing, nor a former administrator. He was renamed and his name is now SouthernNights. Regards, — MoeEpsilon15:57, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
Oh, well, I saw your revert first so I came to talk to you.
I appreciate your explanation. I looked at list of renamed administrators (heck, I looked at every category there was on the page) and he wasn't listed. I wouldn't have persisted except that it was like everything associated with that accounted had been expunged. I'm aware of the Clean Slate policy but this went beyond this. There is still a User page for that account but no associated data and since the page was not deleted (I'm not sure why not), it was odd that there was no historical record....of anything. I had never run into this before. Thanks for filling me in! Newjerseyliz (talk) 16:43, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
He's not listed on former administrators because all his administrative actions and contributions as Alabamaboy were moved to SouthernNights (where he still is an administrator to this day), so there is nothing to list at former except an old name. The renamed section is for administrators who abandoned an account with contributions (i.e older contributions and administrator logs are still in tact, not on their current name) and simple renamings aren't listed. You'd be surprised, actually, how common the simple renames are where old contributions and logs move to a new name and the old name is just a userpage with no data. It's often done to prevent some kind of harassment at the time or to move away from an older name. Regards, — MoeEpsilon17:32, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
Hello! Due to a security update to the wiki software, older versions of STiki are no longer functional. You've been identified as a user of STiki, and are kindly asked to upgrade to the current version at Wikipedia:STiki#Download before continuing with use of the tool. Continuing to use older versions will be detrimental to the STiki project. Please see Wikipedia talk:STiki#Errors for a discussion of this issue or to respond to this message. Thank you! 04:50, 21 August 2013 (UTC)
Sorry, I didn't see the message. I saw the message about STiki thread below that when I came on and didn't look above it. Is there anything about your userpage you'd like for me to do specifically? I don't know exactly what you want. :P Regards, — MoeEpsilon15:29, 31 August 2013 (UTC)
Accidental reverts are a pain, aren't they? I wish the notification system could spot a self-revert-revert and prevent it notifying the other user. In fact, I'll probably suggest that as a feature. — Scott•talk14:52, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Wouldn't be a bad idea. Sorry about the many notifications. Also, yeah, Danny was later desysopped, resysopped again and he's a current admin, so that's the reason for the first revert. One day I hope to have a complete chronology of adminship completed down to this level of detail. Regards, — MoeEpsilon14:55, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
I was just about to comment on that - as it has plenty of entries for people who are current administrators but have been renamed, shouldn't we include that? I did note in my change that Danny regained adminship two weeks later.
It's good to see your work in progress; I'm currently building a spreadsheet for a complete numeric record of admin status changes, in order to do statistics, and currently engaged in the long process of verifying the monthly counts (which I originally compiled for Wikipedia:Desysoppings by month). That's how I encountered this Danny item. I plan to get the spreadsheet up onto Google Docs soon, and you're welcome to have edit access if you like.
You might be able to help with something, actually - the Thatcher131/Thatcher desysop in 2009 needs untangling. I was able to find where he requested the tools back for "Thatcher", his main account, but not where he requested a desysop, which happened in addition to the desysopping of Thatcher131. Could you help me find it? — Scott•talk15:11, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
The only people who are current administrators who are on the former list are administrators who used a different account all together. See Wikipedia:Former administrators/reason/renamed. The accounts under the former column were desysopped and a new account, the one under the current administrator column, was sysopped later. The old accounts retain old administrative logs and contributions, with one exception (Joy/Shallot, which I detailed on the page I linked). Other renames were superficial, such as your renaming from Hex to Scott Martin, because your logs and contributions and logs as Hex are now as Scott Martin, which is why I didn't include them on the list. I'm going to take a look at the Thatcher situation and go find out what happened. Regards, — MoeEpsilon15:40, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Thatcher131 was purely for testing reasons, if I am reading this correctly. His main Thatcher account was desysopped December 5, 2008 per this, then resysopped per the link you provided on the former list. Regards, — MoeEpsilon15:47, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Of course - I hadn't thought to look at SRP on Meta. Thanks for the find. I've removed that note I added to the 2009 page as it doesn't relate to the Thatcher131 temporary account. And thanks for the clarification regarding renames, I see what you mean. Do you think it's worth adding "see also" notes to entries where related transient changes happened, such as the Danny entry? It's going to be great eventually when absolutely all of the historic details (extant in our records) are nailed down. — Scott•talk15:56, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Oops, I guess I fibbed. There are a few more current administrators who have entries, see Wikipedia:Former administrators/reason/temporary, where some current administrators controlled another sysop account temporarily. Danny does have an entry for his old employee account (Dannyisme) there, but nothing about old desyops of his main account. I really tried to keep it as simple as I could by not including past desysops of current administrators, because people could get confused and think that, for example, Danny is a former administrator when he really is a current administrator. That's partially why I started the /admins subpage in my userspace. I wanted to create a complete chronology and hopefully deprecate FORMER as being more comprehensive. It's my intention to include that level of detail in the main namespace of the chronology, where every sysop, desysop, transfering of adminship from account to account, etc. is detailed. For now, I think just the name of the former administrators is best, IMHO. I wish I had more time to dedicate to completing this chronology. Regards, — MoeEpsilon16:11, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
An RfC about the use of the {{fairusereview}} tag on mainspace pages is in progress here. From 2005 until recently, this template was added to file pages when the non-free status of the file was being discussed. In May this year it was edited so that it could be added to articles. The RfC question is: "Should the template be reverted to the pre-May 2013 version, and retained only for use on file pages?"
Hello Moe Epsilon, ZappaOMati has given you an lovely bat, to wish you a Happy Halloween! You see, these things promote WikiLove and hopefully this has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a lovely bat! Enjoy!
Spread the goodness of a lovely bat by adding {{subst:User:Miss Bono/Halloween}} to their talk page with a friendly message.
Yeah, that actually sounds like a good idea. I'll have a look at it sometime. Obviously as you can tell, I've been late updating the starting quarterbacks page because of various real life commitments that keep me away from Wikipedia a lot of the time. I'll see about expanding that page, it sounds worth while. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:51, 3 November 2013 (UTC)
Carliitaeliza: I'm not going to be on then. Try getting on earlier in the day tomorrow. I'll be on today and tomorrow during the day time. At night I am not here. Regards, — MoeEpsilon18:32, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
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Yeah, sorry for not really updating List of NFL starting quarterbacks as much, since I usually tend to get lazy/stressed over how the Bears' season is going. Regardless, being Christmas is a time to celebrate and be happy, and not be frustrated over how one's season is going, I give you best wishes for this holiday season! ZappaOMati16:12, 25 December 2013 (UTC)
Haha, thanks ZappaOMati. As a Steelers fan, I can totally sympathize with you over a terrible season. Hope you had a merry Christmas regardless. Hope to help you with the List of current National Football League head coaches article soon (whenever I have free time again to spend a few hours at a time editing, or maybe the off-season?). Hope you have a good one. Regards, — MoeEpsilon00:38, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
—cyberpowerOnlineHappy 2014 — is wishing you a Happy New Year! This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!
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For your tireless contributions in a variety of areas, from article work such as maintaining List of NFL starting quarterbacks, a page that requires much clerking as well as writing, to behind the scenes items such as posting to the bureaucrat's noticeboard which admins have been inactive long enough to necessitate desysopping, your contributions are truly invaluable to the encyclopedia, and I hereby thank you for all that you have done in 2013, and all you will do in 2014. For the record, should you ever consider applying for a mop, I would be more than honored to nominate you. Happy New Year! GoPhightins!04:27, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
Go Phightins!: Gee, thanks :) It's always nice to know someone is following what I do and thinks that I've done a good job. Maybe one day I will apply for the mop again, and I'll keep you in mind if I need a nominator. I hope you have a good 2014 as well. Regards, — MoeEpsilon06:05, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
Padiddling
Padiddling is, in fact, a real Freestyle technique similar to the nail delay. Finding sources will be difficult but I'll give it a shot. Just a heads-up that you may see it resurface on the article one day. Cheers, Captain Infinity (talk) 04:36, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
Well if reliable sources are provided, that would certainly be okay. I saw that addition while patrolling for vandalism and I generally revert additions of large amounts of text or sections without a source. The wording of the section seemed a little off too, for the tone of an encyclopedia. Regards, — MoeEpsilon06:16, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
Hello Moe Epsilon: Thanks for all of your contributions to improve the encyclopedia for Wikipedia's readers, and have a happy and enjoyable New Year! Cheers, ZappaOMati16:58, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year 2014}} to user talk pages with a friendly message.
Well isn't this a sight for sore eyes? Hey BionicWilliam! I'm glad to hear from you :) I hope you had a good holiday season and new year's day as well, my friend. Regards, — MoeEpsilon13:45, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
Jack Bullas Smith
What makes you think that Jack Bullas Smith was the Hofstra basketball coach? I would like to see your evidence that he is the NFL football player. Do you have any? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.55.254.211 (talk) 17:58, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
Nevermind, I see what you mean now. After a bit of researching I've discovered the name of the basketball coach to be John A. "Jack" Smith. I'll fix this error. Regards, — MoeEpsilon19:14, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
Hi Moe Epsilon. This is Colton Cosmic. I was no-warn, no-discussion permanently blocked for socking in May 2012, but I never did it. I feel like the appeal processes have been a real sham and that I've been ganged up on by reflexive block-deniers along the way. I'm looking for an administrator to look into the record, without just going by what others say about me, and to consider unblocking, or bringing up my case for an RFC/U for a broader-based unblock debate. Excuse my IP blcok evasion at your talkpage, but I feel I've no other way to go forward.
Why ask you? Randomly pretty much. Although I think WP:AN/ANI is an awful place that brings out the worst in some people, and attracts some of the worst people, I decided to look for an admin that made a sensible comment there. Once I detected you there, I checked your other recent contributions, including where you urged transparency as a partial solution for the paid editing question. And then I saw in your articles created collection that you were into pro-wrestling, and I am into that too, although I am more into boxing.
I had a single prior account that edited almost entirely content for five or six years. I was never sanctioned, blocked, banned, or even warned. I didn't even know what the drama boards or Arbcom were. I switched for online privacy reasons to "Colton Cosmic," never going back to the prior account. I was 100% straightforward about this from edit #1: [2]. Does that sound like a sock to you? Timotheus Canens said, once he finally said something, that my prior account was my "main" account and that Colton Cosmic was my "abusive" account. "Abusive." Really? I had only a few weeks before being blocked but I at least created Rain City Superhero Movement which was subsequently twice directly linked by Slate.com. I initiated a third opinion community process WP:3O to solve a talkpage argument and politely abided by the result though it went against my strongly-felt position: [3] (toward the bottom but before you scroll).
It is accurate I became momentarily uncivil. I had seen Youreallycan plaintively beseech Nomoskedasticity to stop wikihounding him. This had occurred for two years. It was tracking, taunting, and targeting: Nomo. would drop in for his or her only edit of the day to say catty comments like "it is safe to ignore Youreallycan on this matter" in an article talkpage discussion and so forth. He or she would mockingly call him "darling." The next day or so I chanced across Nomo. arguing for Youreallycan to be banned. My civility slipped and I called Nomo. a "provocateur" ([4]). I questioned whether he or she had ever contributed anything productive to the project. I viewed myself as confronting a cyberbully. It was half a reaction to Nomo. but half a reaction really to what I found this appalling WP:AN/ANI environment where users routinely fight and manipulate the rules to get each other blocked. This is the only particular edit ever cited by Timotheus Canens to justify my permanent block. In your view, does it? I mean, I have done some good in my other edits.
This is too long already. What else? Silktork and Mastcell have concocted theories about some heinous sanctioned or banned editors I'm supposed to have been. I think they have different suspects. There's no truth to that, and certainly no evidence to it. What am I going to do? I can't prove I'm not Trayvon Martin killer George Zimmerman either. We could talk about it, but they don't want to talk about it. Lastly, Moe Epsilon, if you agree to look into this you can unblock me at my talkpage and I'll answer any questions you have. Please allow me to defend any of my edits you find concerning, and perhaps give context to them. Please don't just go by what others say about me. Colton Cosmic. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.226.68.186 (talk) 13:13, 14 January 2014 (UTC)
Hello, Colton. First I'd like to say to you that I'm not an administrator. I know this must be a major buzz kill to have written so much only to find out I can't do much about it. Next, I am sympathetic towards your situation, which I am familiar with having seen previous discussions. However most administrators here are not only not be willing to unblock, but shouldn't unblock. Since the original block was done through ArbCom sanctions (if I am reading everything correctly), then it should be taken to ArbCom's ban appeals. Knowing that you've been through that already, as well as had a couple threads started at the administrators' noticeboard about you, there aren't many avenues left. Considering that, I feel there isn't much that can be done here. I feel like you should stop going under various IPs to communicate to administrators to get an appeal, because it simply won't work. If you are serious about returning ever again, the best thing you can do for yourself is to admit wrongdoings and to come back at a later time. Log in through your Colton Cosmic account a year from now, enable e-mail and e-mail the blocking administrators to see if you can get your talk page access restored, to request a formal unblock. That is the only way I can see you ever being successfully unblocked. Considering the initial block took place in 2012, you should really move on now, and look forward to coming back at Wikipedia at a later time. Take a wikibreak from Wikipedia for 2014 (IP evading and all), and come back later. I know this is a long time, but this is the only way. Until then, you can still appeal to the ArbCom ban subcommitee, however considering you have poked a few administrators in the past couple weeks, it wouldn't be successful. Sorry for the troubles. Regards, — MoeEpsilon18:25, 14 January 2014 (UTC)
Moe Epsilon, I just saw your response to Colton Cosmic here. That was very well said. You explained the Arbcom issues in a correct way and suggested what to do next in non-bureaucratic style. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 18:08, 22 January 2014 (UTC)
Thanks Ed. I did make one mistake about his e-mail, since he later replied that it was disabled. However, there aren't many avenues left for him now. I fear he may be de facto banned since I don't think anyone is willing to unblock at this point. Regards, — MoeEpsilon18:20, 22 January 2014 (UTC)
Writ Keeper: That is good, I feel like that was the best thing to do. I don't think he would be abusive on his talk page and it leaves him one place to go to formally request an unblock. I wouldn't restore his e-mail ability though, because I still feel he will repeatedly message folks like he did as an IP address. At least with his talk page open, his possibility of returning one day is possible, however slim. Regards, — MoeEpsilon18:32, 22 January 2014 (UTC)
Hi Moe Epsilon See Notification of Inactivity
This is to notify you all that I am no longer able to take part as an Admin or Contributor, as time has caught up with me and I am now eighty-three years old. Health problems are causing me to cease work on what I always enjoyed as a most fruitful and interesting activity, that of contributing to one of the greatest undertakings I have ever had the good fortune to take part in. I wish all of you well and that Wikipedia may continue to thrive. Dieter Simon (talk) 19:51, 25 January 2014 (UTC)
Hi Dieter. Thanks for your time and effort you put into helping Wikipedia. Since you replied before thirty days, it is considered that you are active again. Your message implies you no longer wish to be an administrator or editor, so if you wish to resign adminship formally, you can go to the bureaucrats' noticeboard and formally do it (since I can't help remove the tools for you, sorry). If you don't, you'll get the "pending desysop" messages again in a year and in 30 days after that, you'll be desysopped then. Thanks again for everything. Regards, — MoeEpsilon21:19, 25 January 2014 (UTC)
i got a message but didn't do the edit?
I got a message from you about an edit I did, but I didn't do any edits....
Hi. That message was from the year 2012, so the edit probably came from someone else who previously used the IP address you are using now. I would recommend creating an account to avoid this coming up in the future. Regards, — MoeEpsilon18:29, 29 January 2014 (UTC)
Everyone, for allowing a discussion of an award/barnstar removal discussion to take place at all. At best, the place to go is to the Editor Retention project, who awarded it and bring it up. At any rate, there is no formal process of removing awards, and there shouldn't be. Regards, — MoeEpsilon19:47, 29 January 2014 (UTC)
This is unacceptable; your awarding of a trout is a clear attempt to undermine <random dispute resolution process>, and I will shortly be opening an Arbcom case request to demand both the removal of the trout and the removal of your troutapplier user right. *eyeroll* Writ Keeper⚇♔20:58, 29 January 2014 (UTC)
Well I think the project can also rightfully ignore Andy, since the user was nominated in November, and that the project is aimed at recognizing good editors so we retain them long-term. Though maybe a trout to the WikiProject, for bad timing, but nothing else. Writ: I'm not knocking your sarcasm or anything, but when I was alerted by e-mail of your message, the e-mail cut your message in half. So, here I am, thankful I was not being seriously admonished for trouting. Regards, — MoeEpsilon21:11, 29 January 2014 (UTC)
Thanks Kanonkas, hope to see you around more often. Since you came to edit, you won't be desysopped as inactive now. Thanks for taking the time to confirm your activity. Regards, — MoeEpsilon06:03, 1 February 2014 (UTC)
Thanks, ZappaOMati! It was good working with you for the 2013 season, and I hope to work with you during the offseason in preparation for 2014! Regards, — MoeEpsilon08:22, 3 February 2014 (UTC)
Hi Moe,I am sorry for bother you on IRC,I will not bother you anymore,but I would like to be your friend,please remove the /ignore,and join IRC I would like to chat with you!,Regards--CarliitaelizaTALK18:58, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
Do you know why the last line in awards is appearing bigger than the others? It was happening before, and then I added an award and it's happening again to the last line. Enigmamsg19:13, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
Hello Enigmaman. I fixed the problem in the infobox, it was a few breaks that made the text alter. In that infobox, you seperate awards by using a <br> tag, and you inserted an actual line break, which was causing the problem in it rendering. Regards, — MoeEpsilon20:38, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
Oh, ok. That was there before. It was like this before I edited and it had been that way for a while. Someone added an award at some point and used the wrong line break, so I copied that code when adding a new one. Enigmamsg20:43, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
Hi Moe, I've just seen your message on the AdminStats talk page. I have decided to make the script display all administrative actions, regardless of sysop status. You should see this with the next update at 10:00 UTC. Regards, — JamesR (talk) 09:30, 11 March 2014 (UTC)
Hi, James. Thanks for that, but maybe you could produce both lists on different pages, with current administrators and the current list. I know it wasn't very valuable to me the other way around, but it could be useful information the other way around for others. Just a thought. :) Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:28, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
Not sure why you're asking about an edit from two years ago, but it's pretty blatant vandalism. I highly doubt people call Agent Orange "Orange Herb, 420 Blaze It". Zappa24Mati02:51, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
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